As usual. Of course he'll be called a racist for pointing out stats like this one:
"Blacks are an estimated 39 times more likely to commit violent crime against a white person than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery."
Clearly he doesn't care if you call him a racist, and i don't care if you call me a racist so here's the rest of the story.
The Color of Crime by PJB
31 comments:
I don't know that PJB is a racist but he hangs out with them. The book he refers to is from a group that is not just Right but racist, Jared Taylors American Renaissance, which leads me to be skeptical of its statistics.
The Color of Deception:
http://www.zmag.org/Sustainers/Content/2004-10/19wise.cfm
Jared Taylor, a racist in the guise of 'expert':
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05023/446341.stm
That Zmag link is a joke right? Maybe you should read what you link before you make an ass of yourself.
And as far as the study being racist, well it is about race afterall so I guess it is racist, the word you are looking for is bigoted, in the sense that the outcome was affected by a pre-determined bias favoring one race over the other and since the numbers stand and your only rebuttal is zmag.com that explains the higher crime rate is due to
"as for the disproportionate rate of violent crime committed by blacks, economic conditions explain the difference with white crime rates"
and then goes on to compare how the white devil does more harm to blacks via....
"corporate pollution, consumer fraud"
You know what Im done with this nonsense, youre a jackass and have offered nothing but the usual ad hominem attacks and fringe website analysis.
Thanks for stopping by and bringing absolutely nothing to the table.
I've been familiar with Jared Taylor and his group for years. I've read articles he has written and have read enough by him and about him to say that he is, in fact, a racist. So is his friend David Duke.
Rhino, I am thinking of posting about PJB and Jared Taylor on my blog tomorrow. Perhaps we could discuss it there. I have been a fan of Buchanan's for several years, but I have been troubled by some of his associations with racist groups and publications. (The only possible dispute really on Jared Taylor, for example, is whether he is "racist" or "racialist", and there's not much difference, if any. Buchanan allows his column to be published in the CCC newsletter, which I received for a while, and it is racist. I will include a link to an earlier post of mine on that.
well, you should remember that daniel patrick moynihan, late democratic senator from new york, got into huge trouble with the liberal community when he wrote about welfare as it relates to encouraging women to have children out of wedlock and keeping the father away because that would reduce or eliminate the welfare benefits.
he was villified by the left as racist and blaming the victim when in fact he was just stating the facts. in the end, he was proven correct.
Daniel Patrick Moynihan:
"There is one unmistakable lesson in American history: A community that allows a large number of young men to grow up in broken families, dominated by women, never acquiring any stable relationship to male authority, never acquiring any set of rational expectations about the future — that community asks for and gets chaos... And it is richly deserved." — "Family and Nation", 1965
http://coverthistory.blogspot.com/2007/08/racism-in-conservative-movement-part-2.html
Gary there is nothing really to discuss.
PJB could be a member of the KKK and it wouldn't change the facts. As donkey has already pointed out, you haven't disputed the statistics and you haven't found any that have disputed them. You can argue WHY PJB is writing about the obvious problems with black on white crime, but you can't argue that it is not a problem because it is and it is a bigger problem than black on black crime and white on black crime. You can argue WHY this is the case, you can argue HOW this came to be, you can even try to make excuses for black people and try to justify it if you want, but that doesn't change the facts, and in fact doesn't help the situation in any way.
First, I do not necessarily accept the statistics given their disreputable source.
But OK, for the sake of argument:
"Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against other blacks." Forty-five percent of the victims of violent crime by blacks are white folks, 43 percent are black, 10 percent are Hispanic."
OK, but according to census figures whites are 75% of the population and blacks only 12%. So blacks disproportionately commit crimes against blacks, which is what one would accept since fellow blacks are usually their neighbors. Case closed."The Color of Crime" twists the statistics to make blacks look bad because they are RACIST.
Gary you are an idiot.
The intelligent argument to make would have been that the system is inherently racist therefore directly resulting in a disproportionate number of arrests prosecutions and incarcerations between blacks and whites.
I wouldnt necessarily agree, but at least it would get the debate going.
.... but as is your MO, you ignore the facts, make ad hominem attacks, throw around the fascist, nazi, or racist label willy nilly like the crutch it is to your feeble mind and generally just make an ass of yourself.
Is it beginning to sink in yet that were playing on different levels? Youre still stuck in AAA and Im afraid you just aint ready for the Bigs. Maybe next season.
First, you as usual ignore my point about the statistics. If blacks committed crimes against others randomly then 75% of their crimes would be against whites. Instead, the statistics show disproportionately black on black crime, as one would expect.
Second, I do not throw around the racist label "willy nilly." But Jared Taylor, his group and his book are racist, as surely as David Duke is racist. Read my post today if you haven't.
Third, why is that presumably non-racist conservatives do not condemn racism in their ranks? Morally that should be the starting point.
And fuck you.
Since you feel you can tell me how to make my argument..
"The intelligent argument to make would have been that the system is inherently racist therefore directly resulting in a disproportionate number of arrests prosecutions and incarcerations between blacks and whites."
Let me oblige you. Obviously you expect me to argue that any racial differences in crime rates are due to an undeniable history of racism, poverty, etc. Obviously there is some truth to this argument.
You could offer two alternative explanations:
1) blacks are morally and intellectually inferior. If you make this argument, then you are racist or
2) difficiencies in black culture and society. The difficiences are again undeniable but that leads to the question as to the cause of them. Again you can make two arguments:
1) blacks are intellectually and morally inferior. If you make this argument you are racist.
2) or these deficiencies are due to racism, poverty, etc.
I win.
Lets say there are 2500 cheetahs in and 23000 wildebeest. When a cheetah kills a wildebeest, skewing numbers aside and the fact that the cheetah may kill gazelles as well doesnt really matter as the wildebeest still has a fuckin cheetah problem.
Im sorry Im not going to bite. Unlike liberals I do not think that "blacks are morally and intellectually inferior" and therefore I see no need to coddle them.
... and please at least try to use the word racism and racist correctly. I will not accept yet another word bastardized by liberals to invoke a negative connotation. I think Canadians talk funny and Mexicans are shorter, Im a racist. You think blacks are inferior and need your infinite white liberal wisdom, you are a bigot.
Next!
I don't think that blacks are inferior--I think it's the racism. Don't get me started on those damn wildebeests though.
Or, maybe there's more than 2 options.
Like for example maybe you and your ilk believe that blacks are inferior so rather than point out their deficiencies and hold them accountable (unless they're republicans i mean) you don't talk about it, cover it up, and make excuses for them.
In other words gary, according to YOU either blacks are inferior, or the reason why they commit more crimes or are disproportionately poor is because of white racists.
either way, it's not their fault.
In my view, it's the excuse makers like yourself that cause and exacerbate the problem. i believe that if you force these people to pull themselves up by their bootstraps they will, you and unfortunately many of them believe that it's not possible for one or both of the reasons you stated.
Rhino, then I'm just going to ask you a question: why then do blacks choose to commit crimes at a higher rate?
beats me
I believe in individual responsibility for individual actions. However, you are saying that blacks as as group commit crimes at a higher rate. Again it seems to me that if it's not due to their supposed inferiority (which is the position of Jared Taylor and ilk) then it must be due to their history of slavery, racism, and its effects.
First of all thats a bold faced lie, you do not believe in individual responsibility so dont say so just becasue it sounds good while damn every position you have taken here has indicated otherwise.
Secondly, who says it has to be one or the other? Maybe its both, maybe its neither.
Id would be curious to know how you feel about groups like La Raza, the NAACP, or CAIR? Or is it only white orgs that are bigoted in your infantile mind?
The scourge of slavery has affected millions globally of every shape size and color but it is the liberal white man guilt that insists on providing that crutch to the American black at the detriment of those that they are supposedly trying to help (because they are inferior and need it?) because in the liberal bigoted mind they are incapable of helping themselves.
It is you my friend that is the true bigot, and I for one am disgusted by your ideology of hatred.
I do believe in individual responsiblity but that does not explain a higher black crime rate unless you accept black moral inferiority, which I do not.
Otherwise you are left with the obvious real causes, the legacy of slavery and racism and poverty, which you cannot accept for ideological reasons.
You are disgusted by my ideology of hatred but have yet to condemn the racism of Jared Taylor and associates.In fact you, and Patrick Buchanan, perpetuate it by giving it legitimacy.
once again you ignored my point gary.
Maybe it's the fact that they don't have to clean up their act because you don't put their feet to the fire, or maybe it's because they feel they don't have any choice because you make them believe they're inferior by treating them that way.
Or maybe it's because the dems ARE trying to keep them down by inviting robert byrd to be a MAJOR part of their party, or by inviting RACE baiters and white haters like jesse jackson and al sharpton to be major parts of their party.
I don't have all the answers gary, but i know bullshit when i see it, and the "legacy of slavery" crap that you spew is bullshit.
By legacies of slavery and racism I mean substandard living conditions and comparative lack of opportunity, as well as current racism, which obviously still exists. That is the cause that you can not or will not comprehend.
Does that mean that a poor black kid should not study hard and attempt to advance his status in life? No. Does it mean he should sell drugs on the corner? No.
I am sure that you do not deny the existence of racism, yet here you have an opportunity to condemn the racism of Jared Taylor and his groups, and you have not.He does believe that blacks are inferior. He has said so. Could not such attitudes be part of the problem?
Jared Taylor is not the problem here, but you as always need a scapegoat/villian to oversimplify matters. The overwhelming evidence that he cites is not from the Aryan Brotherhood but rather the DOJ, as to whether he uses them to promote his own racialist agenda is inconsequential to the cold hard numbers.
The sooner white liberals such as yourself stop excusing miscreant behavior because of "slavery" the better off race relations will be in this country and perhaps an integral part of our society will as Rhino states begin to "pick themselves up by the bootstraps" and do for themselves what liberals keep promising to do for them and then blame the "racist" conservative man because you never deliver.
Throw a dart at a map of the world and Ill show you a people that have overcome "legacies of slavery and racism I mean substandard living conditions and comparative lack of opportunity"
The world is not black and white so stop with your divisive politics of hate and blame already, its growing tiresome and is destroying my Country.
Donkey, you make some good points but the problem is that in those areas I don't disagree with you.
My points are these: racism still exists, and Jared Taylor is an example. Worse yet, presumably nonracist Conservatives like Patrick Buchanan cite him, which is appalling.
Second point: the causes of crime and other conditions in the black community is obvious. It is the history and the racism and the poverty.I believe in cause and effect. You have been unable to provide any other explanation. Jared Taylor and ilk have: they think black people are inferior.
Third point: we may disagree on solutions (or we may not). I do not think that welfare is the solution. We liberals learn from our mistakes.Conservatives only offer "pull themselves up by their bootstraps."
Holy shit gary, how many times do i have to say the same thing.
The CAUSE is YOU! You continue to talk out of both sides of your mouth.
Wake the fuck up.
You make excuses for people who do bad things and tell them it's not their fault and they will continue with the same behaviour.
You act like black people are the only people who have ever lived in poverty.
YOU and your ilk CREATED the problems in the black community with your social programs.
illegitimate children wasn't a problem in the black community before welfare. Teenage pregnancy wasn't a problem in the black community before abortion on demand.
Black kids went to college in greater #'s percentage wise before you lowered the standards for them.
These are all FACTS. I could cite the statistics but you would just claim that whoever wrote them was a racist which is why i'm starting to think that i'm an idiot for even addressing you.
Have you just got here? Make good points is what I do, its all that I do.
My point is that bigotry is not monopolized by whitey which liberals would have you believe, and I think its because of their failed policies in education, welfare, the forcefeeding of abortion as birth control, and the de-significantifcation of the church in black communities as well as society in general amongst other reasons that have done more harm to black community than any bigot like Jared Taylor ever could
As but one example look at Northern Ireland. Catholics were historically enslaved, males almost universally unemployed, and overwhlmingly at the receiving end of police persecution despite being the minority yet crime was virtually non-existent. The short explanation is that they policed themselves and yes "pulled themselves up by the bootstraps" My first visit to my family in Ireland, they didnt have indoor bathrooms and the men were out of work or in prison, and now we have, well suffice to day come a long way.
I personally know people that have escaped Communist Russia and others that arrived on fucking rafts and they like me will tell you that your cause and effect is a load of shit and a pacifier to appease the masses that you and your ilk have failed so miserably.
Shame on you and the crutches you provide. It may make you feel better about yourself and alleviate your liberal guilt but you are going a great disservice to this Country and harming those that you claim to want to help.
Ah, so the LIBERALS are to blame! Not the racism and poverty, that I suppose had no effect. Poor people in substandard living conditions have a higher crime rate. That is a fact. Liberal social programs could, at most, only have been a contributing factor if some of them were counter-productive. (I agree with you on a correlation between welfare and illegitamate births.)
What caused the poverty in the first place?
Meanwhile, the poor (and the middle class) are getting poorer and the rich are getting richer (thanks largely to their tax cuts.) I call it trickle on economics.
We arent talking about the cause of poverty today although certainly there is a correlation, we are talking about crime and how it relates to race, and yes I blame failed liberal social policies in part for this.
Good to see you finally catching on. There is hope for you yet...
... huh but now you are blaming the rich? Ok dude youre a lost cause.
Im done with you for the day.
Policies that benefit the rich at the expense of the poor make the problem worse, yes.
I must be a masochist. I enjoy intelligent debate with people who disagree with me, but I never find that here. Instead I find supposedly intelligent so-called conservatives who can't seem to follow an argument, and repeat the same stupid shit over and over and over. Logic and reason seem to play no role in your thinking. Liberals are too blame for all problems, even as in the Iraq War where the conservatives were the people who screwed it up. Yet, we liberals take the blame in advance for Iraq.
I'm done with The Aurora.
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